Living For Others

[afflicted]

Do you believe that it is enough to stay alive for others, even if you are miserable/ill, because you care about their well-being?

Or do you think that you need reasons for yourself, alone, to keep going and that you refuse to hold yourself hostage to the emotions of others?

I suppose another way to look at it..

Is it more selfish to take your own life or want someone to stick around for your own benefit?

Edited October 17, 2013 by afflicted

[Saliency]

I think it is more selfish to want someone to stick around for your own benefit. I know some people really try to bring a person out of their depressed state and help them see the light, but I think if you really wanted someone to stick around that badly, you'd be there for them and make sure that they do stick around. This of course doesn't apply to situations where a person completely hides their suicidal tendencies to the point where close friends/family have no idea what's happening. But when people are aware of that, it's not fair to expect that person to stay alive just for others. If the person who is requesting that is not mentally ill themselves, they have no idea of what kind of pain the person is going through. I think forcing someone to stick around for the benefit of others can cause that person more pain than the pain other people experience due to losing that person. At least for non-depressed people who are grieving, they know that their own lives will go on, they'll be happy again eventually, and they will always have ways of remembering their lost loved one. I think a lot of depressed people don't get those luxuries. What could be more horrifying and finite than ending your own life?

I don't mean to say that family members and friends of suicide victims don't go through horrible grief because of the suicide. But I think ultimately, the person who was so desperate that they took their own life and are now dead is the one who suffered the most. And I wouldn't say they were selfish, because to be selfish you need to do something solely for your own benefit. Benefit can only be measured if you're alive. Suicide is an act committed out of pain and desperation - not selfishness.

Edited October 17, 2013 by Saliency

[Stuarachel]

As soon as my parents pass away I'm going too. I'm only staying here for them

[afflicted]

Thank you Saliency for your thoughtful response.

I too, lean in that direction.

But I think ultimately, the person who was so desperate that they took their own life and are now dead is the one who suffered the most. And I wouldn't say they were selfish, because to be selfish you need to do something solely for your own benefit. Benefit can only be measured if you're alive. Suicide is an act committed out of pain and desperation - not selfishness.

How much pain and desperation must one be in, do you think, for suicide to be a viable option? Where does it cross the line from being a selfish act to an acceptable one, or would you say it's completely subjective? EDIT: Are you saying that suicide can never be done for selfish reasons?

I only ask this because it seems that many are of the opinion that suicide is always selfish, because they believe that the meaning of life is to live for others.

Stuarachel

Since you are living for your parents, am I safe to assume you believe suicide is selfish in the case that your family is alive?

Edited October 17, 2013 by afflicted

[svendorrian]

I usually avoid topics like this because when it comes to talk of any type of "social" need or support- because of some negative personal experiences- leaves a bad taste with me. However my mother, my wife and some others would be totally destroyed if I ended my life.

While I am not living for them, it would not only be selfish, it would be stupid and just plain wrong to harm those would be there to help me.

I can not do that to them. My pain is my own and not for them. I refuse to end my life. That would be like spitting in the face of my own mother, and my mother has always loved me.

Even after my mother passes away there are others including my wife that I would indirectly harm if I took my own life.

This is my life- no one elses- and even though I have depression, my life has been blessed.

I refuse to indirectly harm those who care about me. There is absolutely no place in my life at all for suicide.

If things were different, I may think otherwise.

Edited October 17, 2013 by svendorrian

[Stuarachel]

Thank you Saliency for your thoughtful response.

I too, lean in that direction.

But I think ultimately, the person who was so desperate that they took their own life and are now dead is the one who suffered the most. And I wouldn't say they were selfish, because to be selfish you need to do something solely for your own benefit. Benefit can only be measured if you're alive. Suicide is an act committed out of pain and desperation - not selfishness.

How much pain and desperation must one be in, do you think, for suicide to be a viable option? Where does it cross the line from being a selfish act to an acceptable one, or would you say it's completely subjective? EDIT: Are you saying that suicide can never be done for selfish reasons?

I only ask this because it seems that many are of the opinion that suicide is always selfish, because they believe that the meaning of life is to live for others.

Stuarachel

Since you are living for your parents, am I safe to assume you believe suicide is selfish in the case that your family is alive?

I wouldn't say I think it's selfish at all, I just don't want my parents to find me dead. Their really is no easy way to answer whether it's selfish or not

[Saros]

Questions of selfish versus selfless always tangle me up. Do we act selflessly because:1) it betters our fellows, or because 2) it betters our fellows - and that fact resonates with some deep-seated ideology of ours, and we feel good about it, find purpose in it, and motivated to do it? That's where I stop and wait for someone smarter than me to pick up the conversation. What isn't a selfish act?

Though this thought has never entered into my own suicide: me versus others self-dialogue.

[KeepinOn]

Many days I think about how if it weren't for my son, I really have no reason to go on.

[afflicted]

svendorrian

Thank you for your thoughts on the matter. So, then, is it fair to say that you have your own reasons to live, independent of others?

If things were different, I may think otherwise.

What circumstances would cause you to think otherwise?

[svendorrian]

yes. responsibilities