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Does Bisexuality Exist?


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it's the major, prevailing theory in many expert circles (so i learned in college) that there is a spectrum of sexual orientation. this means that there is a "norm" of people who are bisexual to some extent or another, and then there are some people who are totally straight or totally gay. the theory is that being bi is the norm and that 100% straight or 100% gay is highly unlikely.

what do you think?

as a male sleeping with men, and liking it, and you are also attracted to women and have sex with women, then you are bisexual. i'm a woman married to a man and have had relationships with women, but don't now obviously because i'm maintaining faithfulness in my marriage.

was he mad because you want women, or because of a faithfulness issue? maybe he's insecure that there's no way he could be your everything, because you'd want women too. some people feel threatened by bisexuals, for that reason. many straight people reject us because we're going to go gay on them :hearts: , and gay people reject us because we're not gay enough or something like that. it's strange, IMO.

to me, we're just people, and people are sexual creatures. everyone has their own orientation, whether they're 50%/50% or 100% in any given direction, it doesn't really matter. he should accept your love and accept you as you. you deserve to be with someone, male or female, who loves you for you.

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All the way along we both knew that it couldn't become a major relationship. It was only ever meant to be fun. Which it was. I think the problem is that my active bisexuality offends his sensibilities because he believes in black and white - there are no shades of grey. He cannot handle ambiguity and has problems with the changeability of human emotions. Perhaps not surprisingly he is a doctor.

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Well, this is my theory on the topic. If i fell in love with someone I wouldn't be looking at the fact they were male or female. I don't think that would come into it (for me) because I see something else other than the physical "shell". It's more important for me to feel brain chemistry rather than sex chemistry.

I have had fun with men and women in the past, but recently fell in love with a man. But if I had found all his wonderful attributes in a woman, I think I would've felt the same. It really isn't about gender for me.

Anyway when I was having physical fun with men/women, we called it hetroflexible. Although, there really isn't any need to label anyone.

:hearts:

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I am 100% straight, although I sometimes have sex with men, and it can be very enjoyable as well.

This is a very interesting topic... thanks for sharing.

Not that I'm into labels, but since you're asking, your math doesn't add up for me. You said that your "ex-boyfriend" (not a straight man's term) thinks in black and white and can't accept gray areas, but you define yourself as "100% straight", which is about as black and white as it gets. I have doubts as to whether 100% either way exists but if it did, I don't see how a 100% straight man could bring himself to have sex with another man, let alone develop an ongoing sexual relationship with one. You need to be interested and aroused to some degree to make that happen.

I identify as gay, although I had sex with a few women in my teens and 20s, so I can identify with you as the flipside, the basically gay man who can be attracted to, aroused by, and have sex with a woman on occasion, but generally prefers men. I call myself gay, but I wouldn't say I'm 100%. I suppose I'd say 90-95%, if I really had to put a number on it... but numbers aren't very sexy. :wink:

It seems to me that your relationship with this man was out of balance from the start, and destined to fall apart sooner or later. Not necessarily because the two of you don't agree on percentages, but because he seems to be more needy and emotionally engaged than you, and has probably developed a deeper attachment that you couldn't reciprocate. Something similar happened to me a few years ago when I got involved with a man who was in an open relationship with another man. Although it started out as "fun", my feelings grew more intense and eventually it became too painful to just be his plaything. I wanted more, and he wasn't able to fulfill my needs, so we had a sort of blowout like the two of you had, and the relationship crumbled.

Anyway, it sounds like you've been honest and respectful with your former friend, but it just wasn't meant to be.

Anyway when I was having physical fun with men/women, we called it hetroflexible.

I love it! :hearts: Sexuality is such a fluid and flexible thing... when allowed to be.

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I am 100% straight, although I sometimes have sex with men, and it can be very enjoyable as well.

This is a very interesting topic... thanks for sharing.

Not that I'm into labels, but since you're asking, your math doesn't add up for me. You said that your "ex-boyfriend" (not a straight man's term) thinks in black and white and can't accept gray areas, but you define yourself as "100% straight", which is about as black and white as it gets. I have doubts as to whether 100% either way exists but if it did, I don't see how a 100% straight man could bring himself to have sex with another man, let alone develop an ongoing sexual relationship with one. You need to be interested and aroused to some degree to make that happen.

Yes I see your point. But what I'm trying to say is that being gay or being straight is not so much about sexuality. There is a difference between gay and straight brains in the way the function and genetically there is a difference. Could well be wrong of course and I'm not saying these things to suggest that one is any way better than other because of course they're not. I'm thinking in the same way that someone who's sports oriented has a brain that works in a different way to one that is arts oriented.

Of course to most people I am gay because I have had boyfriends and I have had sex with men. They are gay actions and I'm not in any way ashamed of doing them or enjoying them. I wouldn't admit it to my mother, but that's a different matter.

I can see I'm having trouble getting my point across, which may just be a sign that I'm talking bollocks.

Actually in the relationship I had I think it was probably initially me that was more emotionally engaged but I realised that no matter how much I wanted it, which I really did and still do, it was just not possible because of my complicated life. He started out just wanting fun and then started to want some more. Interestingly though, one of his big reasons for dumping me is that I'm 10 years older than him and he feels that's too big an age gap. When we met he claims he though I was only 2 years older than him. There's a back-handed compliment for you

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Hi, Rick Mitchell:

You're not talking rubbish. You're talking about things that are difficult to put into words. So, let me just jump in...

It seems to me that you're basically talking about identity, and all these labels are getting in the way. Sexuality is on a spectrum and it is fluid, as has been pointed out here.

As I see it, the labels evolved out of a description of sexual behavior, thus the adjectives, homosexual, heterosexual, and bisexual behavior. Over time, they became nouns for a class of people. Labels are a very Western thing and so is this either/or, black and white, right or wrong mindset. Where I live sexual behavior is not necessarily labeled by others or oneself and accepting an identity is not socially pressured (except if one is in a social category we might label as transvestism and transsexualism; but that is another long story).

Historically, as I understand it, oppression (because of a label) resulted in embracing an identity and developing it. Gay identity was a reaction to heterosexual oppression. Lesbian identity became a reaction to heterosexual oppression and let's say gay social dominance and dismissiveness; i.e., a kind of lack of legitimacy. Bisexuality is perhaps still developing as an identity and I think is a reaction to both heterosexual and gay dismissiveness. Many gay and straight people (I don't know about lesbians) are indeed threatened by bisexual people. And they are often dismissed as "fence sitting." Nobody likes to be dismissed, but gay, lesbian, and straight people have an experience of coming to their sexuality in somewhat more definitive way. (We humans tend to judge others by our own experience, right?)

Let me speak a little about my personal experiences. When I was younger, there was a period in which a few bisexual men would approach me. None told me they were married until after "the fact." And I felt quite betrayed. I was a very needy, overly romantic young man looking for love. I would have never conceived of threatening a family by becoming a mister-ess (can I create that word, please :flowers: ), no matter my feelings for him. Of course, thereafter, I ASKED if a guy was married or bisexual.

This leads me, I hope, to my point that communication is key. I understand (now) that those guys were attracted to my skinny little young person that was me. I was acculturating into the amorphous gay community at the time and was astonishingly naive. I do feel that I was taken advantage of, but that's what a lot of men do. However, I wasn't given a choice. I wasn't allowed to negotiate.

Issues of monogamy versus a range of conditional promiscuity are major ones among all gay couples I have known. Talking about one's sexual needs were very difficult for many of them and couples who didn't talk about it ended.

If a partner says that he wants or needs to have one night stands and that is important to him and his partner says, "No, I don't want that" and the issue is non-negotiable, the relationship is seriously "unbalanced," to borrow Burgy's term. It's time to negotiate out of the relationship.

This stuff needs to be discussed early on. And it needs to be continually discussed, as one's needs might change.

Gosh, I've gotten off on a tangent. Please forgive me, because I may not exactly be addressing issues that you have raised. I may be experiencing a bit of mania :hearts: ...

I don't think your ex's excuse for the breakup is your age. I think it was just a way of lashing out, because of his pain. I think he wanted a monogamous relationship with you, which you may not want or may not want now.

In your first post, you wrote "bisexuality as such doesn

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I'm of the opinion that bisexuality exists. I can fall in love with either a man or a woman, as I have done so multiple times.

For me, it's about the strength a person brings to a relationship. If the other person is stronger than I am, I tend to become the passive one, and become more lovey dovey, much like a woman does in a hetero relationship for the most part.

So for me, bisexuality exists.

Edited by whatsizbucket
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There is a difference between gay and straight brains in the way the function and genetically there is a difference.

Lol... Sorry, but I just had to stumble a bit over that one.

I am.. since we are talking numbers.. probably about 85-90% gay. My brain, however, is not different than a straight brain. I cannot bring myself to believe that. How can "gayness" be a physical thing? Isn`t that like, DNA determined? Great, now we`re into that debate. Actually, I refuse to believe that anyone is 100% anything. How can they be? Some straight people have fantasies about being in bed with others of the same sex. It`s just a fantasy, and they probably wouldn`t actually do it. Still, if they are able to "get off" on it, how can they be 100% straight? I`ll buy 99%.. Lol..

I don`t think you`re talking bullsh.. but this is a bit of an odd debate, for me, because I fail to see how one could actually be 100% straight, when a straight man have sex with other men. You`re saying that one could have sex with them, but not fall in love with them, right? Is that sort of the discussion thingy here? Then I don`t get that either. Because, if you can have sex with the person, why not emotions? Perhaps it just seems odd to me, because I don`t seperate between the two. To me, the emotions (love) and the sexual act (the whole getting turned on by someone) is linked.

But that might just be me.

I don`t think I could have had sex, fully, with someone I did not find attractive, but at the same time, I don`t usually find anyone attractive unless there`s something in the personality that really appeals to me. I`ll try saying this another way; for me to be sexually attracted to someone, there has got to be something special in them, something that makes my heart/brain tick! It might be the way they smile, or the shade of their eyes, or the way they light up when they discuss a certain book. You know. Silly little things like that. Could be just humor or general attitude as well. I just don`t get attracted casually, to just some random person that fail to make me tick emotionally or intellectually.

So, perhaps that`s why I don`t get it.

I still won`t accept that there`s something wierd about my brain, just because I happen to like mice better than.. uhm.. right!

We need a nevrologist in here to confirm that... Anyone??

Conclusion: Bisexuality must excist, since there are incividuals out there who can both fall in love with, and be sexually turned on by the same sex. Unless it`s possible that the emotions and the sexual desires are completely seperated. Which I find hard to believe.

(I think I am too intellectually impaired for this type of deep discussion)

Edited by ChrystalR
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This in response to the idea that gay and straight brains are different. To my knowledge there has only one research done on this by Swedish researchers in 2007, that was widely reported at the conclusion. The study involved 45 gay men and 45 straight women. This is a very small sample and not well controlled for other variables and the person's gayness or straightness was self report. I put little value in this particular research study. Statistics and data can scew the data away from neutral results.

If there is a difference, consider that the research done on the corpus callosum (bridge between the brain hemispheres) has been extensive and well accepted. Studies have shown differences in areas such as type of occupation. Babies are not born with occupations. The conclusion would seem to be that one's occupation changes the brain. This leads me to logically think that a man believing that he is gay and living as a gay man might develop differences in a part of his brain. A woman believing she is straight and living that life would develop differences.

Many theorists agree with what LoonATik said about sexuality being a spectrum or on something similar to a bell curve. That totally gay people are at one end, totally straight people at the other with both groups being a very, very small percentage of the population. Bisexuality would be in the middle representing a much larger percentage of people. However, the wide majority of people would fall somewhere in between the middle and the ends. The theorists believe that the majority of people (perhaps 80-85%) are somewhere between gay and bi, or bi and straight.

I agree wholeheartedly with the posts that say that love is love! Essentially, this discussion is meaningless here because we are all the same "side" of the issue. As Burgy says, labels are meaningless. Go with your heart!

Iowa

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Obviously I agree bisexuality exists. Pretty much everyone is bisexual in the sense that almost everyone is capable of having sex with people of either gender. What I mean in saying that it doesn't exist is that I don't believe it exists as a separate identity in the same way as heterosexuality and homosexuality does. I could well be way off beam here but I honestly believe that there is a difference between heterosexuals and homosexuals, be it in the brain, genetic, whatever. Please believe me I'm not making value judgements here - I'm not trying to say one is better than another or that one is in any way damaged.

Because of this I believe that who you wish to have sex with is a separate issue. Therefore I can say that I am in one sense bisexual - I can have and have had sex with members of either gender and could fall in love with a man or a woman, although it is actually more likely to be a woman. However, having said that I would identify myself as being straight, even though I will freely admit to anyone, except perhaps my mother, that I sometimes sleep with men

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No worries, Rick. You're clearly not making value judgments. There are so many perspectives of sexuality in its many forms, surely none of us will see it in the same way. Bisexuality is a bit of a hot-button issue, since there seem to be many who either don't believe it exists or somehow resent those who identify as bisexual, and then of course there is the whole bisexual community (of which we have many here) who might feel invalidated or wrongly judged by those sentiments.

Studies of brain structure regarding sexuality have been scant and inconclusive, and most medical and psychological establishments will tell you there are most likely many factors that contribute to a person's sexuality, having to do with both genetics and environment. It can make a person crazy to try to figure out what made you the way you are. The most important thing, in my opinion, is to love and appreciate yourself for exactly who you are, regardless of any of that.

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  • 2 weeks later...
Guest CH1980
some people feel threatened by bisexuals, for that reason. many straight people reject us because we're going to go gay on them :hearts: , and gay people reject us because we're not gay enough or something like that. it's strange, IMO.

This is very true.

My ex-husband (I was with him 2 years) always felt threatened and did not like me calling myself bisexual. So I just called myself straight when I was around him, because I was afraid of confrontation.

Before him, when I was in college, I hung out with a group of lesbians, and I never really felt fully accepted around them unless I called myself a lesbian, too.

Edited by CH1980
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I'm a lesbian and have never been in a relationship, but if I did get with a girl that said she was bisexual, I think I would react badly to that, especially if she'd actually been in a straight relationship (I guess the longer time goes on, the more chance a future partner of mine will have had partners before...) I suppose part of me would feel threatened about that but a lot of me would project my own sexual dislike of men onto my partner and the thought of her with a man would really bother me...

Perhaps I'm being shallow there...

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YOUR NOT BEING SHALLOW BINDI...I WOULD BE THE SAME WAY AS YOU OR MAYBE WE BOTH ARE SHALLOW..:]] WHO KNOWS, BUT YEA THE LONGER YOU WAIT THE MORE PARTNERS THEY WOULD HAVE AND IT DOES SUCK BC MY BOYFRIEND IS 29 IM 21 HE HAS HAD WAY WAY WAY MORE PARTNERS THEN ILL PROBABLY EVER HAVE AND THAT REALLY BOTHERS ME BADLY! SO I KNOW WHERE YOU ARE COMING FROM AND ITS BAD U KNOW! :]]

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  • 3 weeks later...

I feel that if you enjoy having sex with men, and enjoy having sex with women, you're bisexual. If you have sex with your own gender, but you only appreciate it for the simple fact that it's sexual, then you're a straight person that's indifferent to gender. Simple as that.

I identify as bisexual because I have the capacity to love men and women, and appreciate the subtle differences in lovemaking between the two. To be frank with you, I think everyone is bi-, or supposed to be, anyway, whether or not they're sexual.

Edited by ChrystalR
ToS
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Obviously I agree bisexuality exists. Pretty much everyone is bisexual in the sense that almost everyone is capable of having sex with people of either gender. What I mean in saying that it doesn't exist is that I don't believe it exists as a separate identity in the same way as heterosexuality and homosexuality does. I could well be way off beam here but I honestly believe that there is a difference between heterosexuals and homosexuals, be it in the brain, genetic, whatever. Please believe me I'm not making value judgements here - I'm not trying to say one is better than another or that one is in any way damaged.

Because of this I believe that who you wish to have sex with is a separate issue. Therefore I can say that I am in one sense bisexual - I can have and have had sex with members of either gender and could fall in love with a man or a woman, although it is actually more likely to be a woman. However, having said that I would identify myself as being straight, even though I will freely admit to anyone, except perhaps my mother, that I sometimes sleep with men

I don't understand the "I honestly believe that there is a difference between heterosexuals and homosexuals" part. Why do you have this belief? Is this something that is more comfortable for you? You agree that bisexuality exists, but you also identify yourself as heterosexual. Is this social conditioning? Is it a choice that you are making? I just don't understand why. Perhaps you could elaborate on that point, though I realize you have said quite a lot already.

If you want to identify as heterosexual but have sex with men, then you are going to run into people who are going to label you differently than you are labeling yourself. Most people (I'm one of them) would describe your behavior as bisexual. I think you are just going to have to accept that despite the fact that you think otherwise. It will be a problem in your communication with others, as I think it was with your boyfriend and with people responding to your post.

For the record: bisexuality exists. I am a bisexual male. I am attracted to both genders and have had lasting relationships with people of both genders. I am physically attracted to both men and women, and I am perfectly happy being in a relationship with someone of either gender.

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I don't understand the "I honestly believe that there is a difference between heterosexuals and homosexuals" part. Why do you have this belief? Is this something that is more comfortable for you? You agree that bisexuality exists, but you also identify yourself as heterosexual. Is this social conditioning? Is it a choice that you are making? I just don't understand why. Perhaps you could elaborate on that point, though I realize you have said quite a lot already.

Personal experience leads me to believe that in the same way that women look at the world and act in a different way, it is the same for heterosexuals and homosexuals. I

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Something I'm just curious and confused about the original post is that...why were you in same-sex relationships (in that you would call each other boyfriends apparently) when you are, as you claimed, 100% straight?

It's one thing to fool around with guys and say you just enjoy the sex, it's another to be in an actual relationship. The latter would entail emotional components too. Like, by your definition, you would call him a 'boyfriend' but not a 'sex partner'? I can't say I speak for all but I would imagine that's the part that confuses many people and that's why they would be intend to label you as 'bi' or 'gay.'

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Ah yes that is a very good point. Was there or could there ever been any real emotional committment? I think ultimately the answer to that question is probably no. So you could say why use the term boyfriend - well I suppose it's because I can't think of a more appropriate alternative.

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Was there or could there ever been any real emotional commitment? I think ultimately the answer to that question is probably no.

If you don't mind me asking, why would you think that?

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because he believes in black and white - there are no shades of grey. He cannot handle ambiguity and has problems with the changeability of human emotions. Perhaps not surprisingly he is a doctor.

Because he is a doctor?... LOL! I find that very interesting. I was in a 10 year relationship with another man, and he was a DOCTOR! He was the most mal-adaptive partner I have ever encountered. Even after 12 years of moving on(and we still are friends), I still ask myself why, Why, WHY?

I came out of that relationship feeling like most docs are like CPAs.....yep, the black and white of all things human, with no grey inbetween. I encouraged his "changeability" of emotions so dramatically, I had to let him go. I guess I was the Frankenstein who finally created the perfect doctor, and set him free.

I do like having relationsips with women too, though. I consider myself "functionally" gay, but a good looking woman has never let me down. I like the comfort of women....the relationship, the sex, the smells. Occasionally, I have even found women that fullfilled all my desires. Yet, men seem to foot the bill when it comes to mental/psychic connection.

I'm just comfortable with whomever I'm with at the moment, if the moment fits the person.

Deepster

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