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On 8/3/2019 at 10:40 AM, gandolfication said:

 

Ok.  Grandiose homage to language over.

 

Hey @gandolfication, I'm happy to hear (well, see) that you are keeping busy. That's great. I often think about you and wonder how you are doing.

I occasionally ruminate about language & how it developed over the millenia. I read a book once called The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind. The author, Julian Jaynes, described his theory about the influence of language in humans becoming consciousness. I can't do his idea justice but it was a fascinating read. I'd recommend it to anyone, though I think human consciousness arose well before he thought it did--the symbolism of art has to be taken into account as well.

Anyhoo. It's great to see you posting, my friend!

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3 hours ago, JD4010 said:

Hey @gandolfication, I'm happy to hear (well, see) that you are keeping busy. That's great. I often think about you and wonder how you are doing.

I occasionally ruminate about language & how it developed over the millenia. I read a book once called The Origin of Consciousness in the Breakdown of the Bicameral Mind. The author, Julian Jaynes, described his theory about the influence of language in humans becoming consciousness. I can't do his idea justice but it was a fascinating read. I'd recommend it to anyone, though I think human consciousness arose well before he thought it did--the symbolism of art has to be taken into account as well.

Anyhoo. It's great to see you posting, my friend!

Great point JD...I was thinking of I think the same concept after I wrote the above effusive gobbeldygook - that is the relationship between images/symbols (are they different?) and language.  Academic and reading and study skills literature is full of notions of whether peoples' learning style is predominantly visual, auditory, or I forget the others, kinesthetic, or autodidact, I don't remember beyond auditory and visual.

Anyway, I have always framed the question for myself as one of primacy and ultimateness, as follows.  What happens first, and what happens next?  Some people (my theory assumes) hear or read words, and then visualize images in their mindseye.  Others, predominantly, see images and then translate into words.  In reality of course, we all (who have our senses) do both, but again the idea is primacy and ultimateness. What is dominant, and what default to you terminate to?

So for me, and probably in part because I'm not much of a visual artist (I don't draw or paint), when I'm watching a movie even, I will fairly quickly revert to translating (some might say attempting to 'reduce') the concepts and emotions to words.  Others, presumably, even when reading a great book or listening to a great speech, begin almost automatically to imagine visual images (I do not).

A corollary of my theory that words and language are ultimately more fundamental, is that even those visually-dominant types, consciously or otherwise, necessarily convert images to words.  And this goes to the linguists (which your author seems to be, and sounds interesting), posit that without language, there are in fact, not actual thoughts.  They say they have demonstrated this by research on babies - I'm not sure it is 'proven', but my bias naturally accepts it.  (eyesight seems pretty damn important too).

So, my hypothesis is that before fully experiencing the thought, the thinker must be translating some of the visual or auditory stimuli into -- you guessed it -- words, which are, what, ultimately, but a different sub-type of symbols.

Anyway, this is my half-baked theory.

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On 8/3/2019 at 11:17 AM, gandolfication said:

That's a good question, I don't know, I left a voicemail for my former boss yesterday to ask that very thing.  I asked specifically if he would be willing to be a good reference for the legal research and writing endeavor I am pursuing, which is a skill he perpetually complimented and praised me for.  His main counter could be that I was often slow and getting things done, by his and by litigation standards.

so anyway, I expect I'll find out next week if he has any willingness to be any kind of reference.

I just spoke briefly to him and he said yes he would be a reference and simply say that he ran out of work for me to do.

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I'm struggling to cope right now....doing some work each day, but not enough, and am under water. I'm trying to rely on principles of letting go of negative thought patterns, but teetering always on the edge of belief in hope and desperation and desire to end the pain with finality.

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39 minutes ago, gandolfication said:

I'm struggling to cope right now....doing some work each day, but not enough, and am under water. I'm trying to rely on principles of letting go of negative thought patterns, but teetering always on the edge of belief in hope and desperation and desire to end the pain with finality.

I can only imagine. What a nasty position to be in. If it helps any, I'm in a similar mode today.

Damn, bro...wish we could enjoy a psychic journey right now.

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17 hours ago, gandolfication said:

I'm struggling to cope right now....doing some work each day, but not enough, and am under water. I'm trying to rely on principles of letting go of negative thought patterns, but teetering always on the edge of belief in hope and desperation and desire to end the pain with finality.

That's the thing: there's no industry for mental disorder sufferers, we have to compete in the same job market as high-achievers with zero mental disorders whatsoever.

Jobs are for people who won't be emotionally affected by adversities regardless of how tough; do you think us DF members including yourself is capable of that?

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On 8/5/2019 at 2:06 AM, gandolfication said:

So for me, and probably in part because I'm not much of a visual artist (I don't draw or paint), when I'm watching a movie even, I will fairly quickly revert to translating (some might say attempting to 'reduce') the concepts and emotions to words.  Others, presumably, even when reading a great book or listening to a great speech, begin almost automatically to imagine visual images (I do not).

Me too.

How you doing today? (((hug)))

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Earlier I had put together some good materials to sell my legal research and writing service, and started pitching it for some potential work.  I need to do a lot more of this fast.  I don't know if I'm up for it though with just not wanting to be here.

 I Iad some really heavy bad stuff happen today.  Haven't talked to my wife about it; not sure if or when I will.  Talked to my 1 friend from DC.

Feels like I've run out of options.

Not sure how much longer I can hang on here, or even want to.  Paint and suffering just keeps getting worse.

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On 8/7/2019 at 11:35 PM, gandolfication said:

 

 I Iad some really heavy bad stuff happen today.  Haven't talked to my wife about it; not sure if or when I will.  Talked to my 1 friend from DC.

Feels like I've run out of options.

 

On 8/8/2019 at 7:46 PM, gandolfication said:

 

I am hopefully very close to resolving my first immediate legal problem, from 3x-employer, to be followed immediately by not having any income from giving up the unemployment.
What a scab of a person he is.

What's going on? 😞

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On 8/8/2019 at 10:46 AM, gandolfication said:

 

I am hopefully very close to resolving my first immediate legal problem, from 3x-employer, to be followed immediately by not having any income from giving up the unemployment.
What a scab of a person he is.

Why do you have to give up unemployment? 

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On 8/9/2019 at 6:39 PM, Rattler6 said:

Why do you have to give up unemployment? 

Because my sociopathic former boss threatened all kinds of litigation and ethical bar complaints if I didn't.  When he fired me, I signed an 'adhesion' contract letter, with a single line saying I wouldn't be filing unemployment for benefits.  In exchange, he forgave the $10,000 loan he had given me to move my family back from DC.   I did this because I really had little choice (that's what an adhesion contract is), and because he stated, "I know you're probably going to file for unemployment anyway," which I took to mean he didn't really care.  I wasn't (and still am not) knowledgeable about how much % the employer actually pays when a former employee files a claim.

And employer's making an agreement requiring an employee to waive their unemployment rights is patently illegal under Ohio law, which I told him.  He wrote up a 5 page indictment (figuratively) as a response he was going to file with unemployment opposing my claim.  It included a few unflattering things I had written in a messaging app, which they scrubbed from my computer.  I wasn't able to delete it because before I walked back to my office, they'd locked me out.

He made up, fabricated, and otherwise grossly exaggerated a litany of things for why I was fired for cause.  Now, I hadn't disputed being terminated for cause; in fact, for cause/performance is the reasons I listed on my unemployment claim.  He was, however, going to make arguments that I had violated policy and law.  I hadn't.  But likely it would have come down to his witnesses--his paralegals--against my trying to disprove a negative, a nearly impossible thing to do.

I drafted up a 10-page response, explicating why each of his charges were false, fraudulent, wildly out of context and inaccurate.  I added an indictment of his behavior including repeated d*ath* threats that became increasingly specific toward the end of my tenure, and a bunch of other unprofessional, harassing, unethical conduct.  They were all true.  They were in keeping with his character, including previous times he was sued and lost by former clients.  So it would have surprised exactly no one - not judges or the bar - to hear these complaints.

But all of these facts and law and rules, miss the point.  This was mutually assured destruction, but was also asymetrical.  I don't have the resources to mount a protracted fight.  He does.  We both know that.  So I withdrew the unemployment claim.

Since what he did is illegal and unethical, part of me thinks....well, I have all this in writing now, so now I could really turn the screws to him.  But you can see how this would end up just being vindictive, or at best defensive, and wouldn't help me at all.  Also, his middle son is still my best friend, who they copied.  We're still friends.  He understands.  That's important to me. 
Sorry, long answers.

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I'm working on a job app right now, but I've been doing very badly.  

Down to our last $500.

I've put out a proposal to another friend to do a legal research project.  And then others.

All of this just seems so endless.  2010 I think was the year I joined DF.  From the beginning, my depression has always been mostly job/stress-related.  Sure, it has bled into virtually every area of life - that's what depression usually does, right?  But I guess I'm just losing it.  The will to keep trying.  The belief I can make things meaningfully better (even after lowering expectations to nearly nothing).  

Nothing really feels good any more.  Fight or flight is always on.  I only want to sleep.  I'm tired of being in the position of a victim.  I don't know what parts disease and dysfunction, and self-indulgent, 'lazy,' learned helplessness pervades me.  

I want something better.  Maybe that something is oblivion, maybe it's the one thing I've been 'right' about since almost the beginning.  Things with my wife, and somewhat with my kids have continued to suffer.  Other than pain, life doesn't seem real, and hasn't for a long time.  I think a lot of that comes not just from the suffering in the moment, but the absence of any object of hope for the future.

As I write this, I realize I'm ruminating again.  I've been trying to notice this, and let it pass through with less judgment.  Change the conscious self-talk response.  I have moments, but suppose I couldn't say it's going very well.  

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@gandolficationif you're like me, thinking about employment & money are all-pervasive so your experiences are colored (and dominated) by those thoughts. I get to the point where I can't enjoy anything because my head is elsewhere--no matter how fabulous the experience might otherwise be. I've tried "being in the moment" and all that jazz, but I almost instantly pop back to my default state of constant worry and anxiety.

I don't know where I am going with this because I don't have any good advice. I guess it's merely from the "misery loves company" file.

Wish I was more helpful. 😞

Edited by JD4010
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I don't remember the last time I was in the moment or if I ever was.  I've been lost in my head for 40 years.  I've never had a moment of peace yet.  I've had a terrible life.  There has always been something awful going on and also more awful things coming up.  My head is constantly full of stressful things.  I can't enjoy anything.  I'm in a constant state of panic thinking what am I going to do now all the time.  It's been 40 years of thinking my life is going to get completely obliterated this week for sure.  How could I possibly make it through this.  This has been my life.  No wonder my brain is self destructive.  Who the hell wants to be here?

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4 hours ago, gandolfication said:

But you can see how this would end up just being vindictive, or at best defensive, 

I fail to understand: can someone explain how is this wrong?

Or worse than what g's ex-boss did?

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Yikes, that sucks. I guess at least the $10,000 loan is gone... I guess that's a weight off your mind at least.

Does your wife know about these two things? The loan and that it's been swapped for unemployment benefits?

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21 hours ago, Sophy said:

Yikes, that sucks. I guess at least the $10,000 loan is gone... I guess that's a weight off your mind at least.

Does your wife know about these two things? The loan and that it's been swapped for unemployment benefits?

Yes.

It's a s***** situation.

Among other things, I'm contemplating blowing the whole thing up by reporting the whole thing to the bar myself and suing.

What he did, and what I can prove, is so much worse than anything I've done or that he could prove or even alleges really.

It would be a long painful road.

And at the same time, I'm seriously considering leaving this world, so who cares.

I'm just not sure I have the stamina or wear with all or desire to keep going.  And I think I have very easy free immediately and always available means and access right across the street does it happens.

So I'm a mess.

And I'm isolating pretty well.

Edited by gandolfication
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On 8/12/2019 at 4:18 PM, sober4life said:

I don't remember the last time I was in the moment or if I ever was.  I've been lost in my head for 40 years.  I've never had a moment of peace yet.  I've had a terrible life.  There has always been something awful going on and also more awful things coming up.  My head is constantly full of stressful things.  I can't enjoy anything.  I'm in a constant state of panic thinking what am I going to do now all the time.  It's been 40 years of thinking my life is going to get completely obliterated this week for sure.  How could I possibly make it through this.  This has been my life.  No wonder my brain is self destructive.  Who the hell wants to be here?

Sh*t.  Sorry.

It hasn't been 40 years for me a feeling this way, but I certainly understand and unfortunately mostly share your experience and view of life.

I know that you have been successful in your sobriety, so I don't mean this literally, but you're experience above makes me think, wow such a good candidate for some can nabis and alcohol.  

Please disregard, as I am not seriously suggesting that for you.  Though I do remember in my 12-step program, hearing and seeing all about the misery of those trying to remain sober without the spiritual dimension of the 'program.'

Anyway, I'm sorry I'm just rambling.

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On 8/12/2019 at 7:47 PM, iWantRope said:

I fail to understand: can someone explain how is this wrong?

Or worse than what g's ex-boss did?

So he fired me, and then so doing had me sign an agreement letter waving my rights to file for government unemployment benefits.

That is expressly illegal by Ohio statute, no matter what.

Then he threatens to file complaints with the unemployment commission and the Ohio supreme Court for ethics violations which were either completely fabricated or specious due to total exaggeration and abdicating his own responsibility.

Mainly, he was just a dishonest d**k head in the way that he treated me, after I poured my blood sweat and tears into his practice for 10 months.

Ah, I want to stop talking about this now.

I need to just get past it.

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I think if I checked out today or tomorrow, my parents and step parents and other friends and family would rally around my wife and kids let them stay with them and help support them while they recovered or whatever the right term is.

I owe one friend a phone call before I actually would go through with it.

I just cannot manage any more to live in this life in this psychopathic capitalist system with chronic and acute stress of competing in a fundamentally corrupt and dishonest system, and living only for the credits we call money, any more.

It is not that I think I am better than anyone else out there. I don't.  It's just that the system makes people worse, and in any case, I can't deal with it.

Edited by gandolfication
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I am so sorry things are so crappy right now. Remember that you are irreplacable to your kids  - they don't care about money - they care anout Dad. Leaving them would affect their lives everyday. If you can't stick around for yourself - stick around for them. I have seen the impact of leaving first hand. We were at my Mother in laws house with the kids when the cops showed up to let the family know that my brother in law was gone. My daughter does not remember because she was too little, but the boys knew what was going on and it effects them to this day.

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