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Posts posted by Saros

  1. I don't know how often a person "should" think about suicide, but the rate you describe doesn't seem healthy. How long have you kept a journal, and why? It seems to me that suicidal thoughts written down are better than those that stay closed up. It's been suggested to me a few times to journal, but...motivation.

    Are you looking for advice? I can't tell. You might try and examining your journal through the lens of cognitive traps?


    (it's the 19th post)

    The first two (all or nothing thinking, overgeneralization) jump out as potentially relevant to the thoughts you entertain.

    Or maybe just commiseration? There have been periods this year when I thought about suicide every day, and partially acted on it. It can be difficult to deal with for anyone. Some solidarity here.

  2. You are not "supposed to" experience a certain thing while a teenager. Whoever tells you otherwise is selling snake-oil. If you're up for it, you can always try tomorrow, or when you're able.

    For the rest, it sounds like you're hung up on a conflict between "fair" versus reality, and how you feel betrayed.

    Feeling betrayed is OK, and can take some time to get over. My first instinct is that talking about it is a good thing, even just by posting here.

    It seems comparing your channel and the other is an unhealthy idea. Unless comparing channels is going to motivate you to try harder and excel, you might try and find a way to let go. Easier said than done, but possible.

    I'd also advise a peer of mine to consider that it's never to late to try something new. Your post is seeded with ideas that it's too late, or that you've missed your opportunity to get some education, or that it's this youtube channel, or nothing. I feel that is probably the most unfair thing in your post.

  3. Welcome to the forums.

    My first thought is that there's plenty that could be going on, and therapy might help you work through the thing and get personal clarification. Have you tried with a pdoc?

    Anyway, I've gone through phases here and there throughout my life so far. Sometimes (for me) it's just the excitement of having something new and unexplored. I'm much more about the process rather than achivement. Once the process has slowed and I've learned a bunch about it, meh. I don't have much drive to succeed with it. I don't think that's a bad thing for a person - I try to cater to it, lately.

  4. You tried two SSRIs simultaneously over the course of two months (not 2 for one month each)? Seeking clarification because, as I think you already know, any single med could take two months to become therapeautic.

    It's good to know what your meds do (re: affecting this or that neurotransmitter) but keep in mind the actual role these chemicals play in depression is unknown. Additionally, any elevation or decrease of a single neurotransmitter can propagate changes throughout the brain. Feedback loops can result in SSRIs influencing dopamine and norepinephrine, along with who knows what else in the brain. You may be lower than average on dopamine, but it may be a serotonin agonist that pushes you to a new and happier steady state. My point is not to use neurotransmitters targeted by a specific drug to discount the entire category. And one SSRI may have a profoundly different effect than another in any one person. If this doesn't apply to you, apologies.

    All that being said, I do think it's important to do your research, just as you've done.

    Therapy helps many people. If you can't afford to see a psychiatrist (which is my first recommendation if you're trying pharma), is therapy cost-prohibitive too? For many people, therapy is the "cure", while medication is a stop-gap.

  5. Most weeks I don't talk to anyone. For me, it's more acceptable and less of a problem when I stop imagining how things are "supposed to be", and stop comparing myself to peers and social adverts suggesting life is a big party. There aren't any rules or "should-be's". Lots of people get down on themselves because they measure themselves against others, and determine their own wants based on what their peers want (or have). When I focus strictly on what I want, the pressure is taken off. This may be easier for me because I'm ambivalent about socializing - I recognize the elements of me that are asocial. I imagine this won't be as applicable to others who are fully social but inhibited by something. Just my 2 cents.

    edit: I don't think separating what I want from what I think I'm supposed to want is as easy as it might be imagined, for anyone. It took me a while to begin realizing I didn't want the social role my family wanted, and by degrees I felt less bad about not measuring up.

  6. How fast does a opiate addiction take to start. If I took one hydrocondone painkiller, to expirement to see if it helps anhedonia, is there a chance id become addicted? I dont want to become a drug addict , just want to see if it does anything.

    Varies between people. Addiction happens because you teach a brain there's a connection between pleasure and some thing. I imagine it's easier to forge that connection when the pleasure is much greater. The brain learns the connection, and continues to desire the stimulus even after a loss of efficacy. Paradoxically, it seems a loss of efficacy translates to the desire becoming greater. Time doesn't seem to help some people's brains un-learn that connection.

    After one pill? I have no idea, though it seems unlikely. I'm not a physician. If I were you I would ask one. They can't take it away from you. If you're concerned about addiction, you might re-consider taking any. While a few may not be addictive, taking them regularly to manage depressive symptoms will stack the deck against you.

    There are non-addictive dopaminergic anti-depressants if you haven't already explored them.

  7. I agree with everyone else's sentiments.

    I choose to believe the preacher (or anyone else, really) would change his mind if he had a closer brush with depression, in the first-person, or through family or friends, and that his armchair opinion probably comes from a place of happy uninvolvement. I blissfully believe that if he had all the gathered data presented to him regarding depression, he would recant his opinion.

    While it's still an irritating comment, I can understand it having been made, when voiced from a position of ignorance. I hope someone can offer him an opposing viewpoint soon, especially since he has a pulpit to speak to others.

  8. Saros, I TOTALLY understand your dilemma right now...

    Sunshine, thank you for your kind words. I agree with you. I should not, nor should anyone else, measure their own lives by the yardstick of other people's successes.

    That being said, what "gets to me" is not that they're doing fantastic thing A or laudable thing B, while my truck is broken down and I debate over generic versus brand-name breakfast cereal. It's that they can do something. It's a real twist of the metaphorical knife whenever a peer is describing to me the evolution of some issue. In this regard, I am unable to cease from comparing myself to them, even if just in an internal dialogue, especially so whenever I inevitably hear some variant of "so, how are you doing?". For what seems the longest time, I have been mired up to the neck in cement. I have made no progress versus depression, and in some respects have lost ground. No evolution of my life outside of depression. This fact makes me want to abandon social connections altogether.

    That being said, I have kept my sink free of dishes for these past two weeks. This is an absolute beast of a record for me. Small victories. I must admit progress.

  9. OK, so. Risperidone:

    currently at 2mg, planning to increase again soon.

    During first two weeks, I felt more present in daily activities, i.e. engaged. I have become interested in a few things. I have read a few pages of interesting books here and there. Music is passingly interesting again, which hitherto defined my life. Not reached "pre-anhedonia" levels of interest, if such a thing exists. But ANY level of interest and enjoyment or satisfaction is an improvement because it has been completely closed to me in (at least) the past year, minus a few moments of reprieve during fleeting bupropion/adderall honeymoons. I have had the stirrings of desire to pick up the sketchbook or the guitar (though no action yet. Still, stirrings is better than nothing).

    Have found simple humor funny, and have laughed at some things on tv, radio, or written, AND have gotten a bit tearful at maudlin narratives. This is a seachange. Especially so because I have been alone when they have occurred, and I have not had anyone else around to piggyback on their emotions, so to speak.

    In short, feeling less wooden and more like a dynamic person. Sad to say that benefits have subsided somewhat after those first two weeks. Hope I can reclaim them with a dosage increase.

    Has anyone else tried an atypical, having had anhedonia and an extremely flat affect? I would like to recommend it, but I have no idea about how different the pathologies of anhedonia can be, or whether the risperidone is directly affecting the anhedonia, or some larger symptomolgy, which then in turn affects anhedonia. I certainly have other depressive issues we're trying to treat.

    edit: should add I felt some of these positives the first 36 hours after initial dose, if that's even possible.

  10. Welcome. All that anxiety sounds very difficult. Trial-time to see positive benefits of anti-deperssants can be up to two months, so it may be a little while before you get some relief. In the meantime, the forum is pretty supportive and could help you ride out the next few weeks.

    Did you just start therapy too?

  11. ...

    So you've gone from apathetic to angry, corresponding with titrating down on the meds?

    There could be underlying issues, but you're the best person to assess the possibility for that. You may have to just ride it out for a few months until the medication is finally half-lifed out of your system, and after that when your chemistry decides on a new balance point. Whatever your mental health specialist can suggest or recommend would be better-informed than my opinion.

    Anyway, if there's one point of real information I can offer, it that's plenty of people here have posted apparent withdrawal side-effects after having been on meds for a while, and these have included altered mental states. Anger, confusion, and crying jags have all been described.

    Hope things get better for you soon.

  12. SomethingWhatever-

    there's a lot of thesis and antithesis in this thread, and it's not all directly in response to your post. Some of the posts in this thread are well-intentioned but are a thin veil covering the poster's own relevant negative personal experiences. Try to not take it as personally as some of your posts suggest. Some of the posts here are purely supportive. I'm not chiding you or anything, just saying that you should see some positive here. Does the entire thread make you feel bad? It kind of sounds like you're stuck in a cognitive trap, which can systematically distort how we judge our lives, and not always in ways we're aware.

    If there's one parting thing I'd want to offer, it's:

    -Somtimes life sucks for some of us, and not for others

    -It's not always easy to tell who it sucks for

    -Comparing oneself to others can be a recipe for a downward spiral

    I know that those three things aren't entirely satisfying, I don't suggest they will be. But they can be helpful, I think.

    Hope things get better for you soon.

  13. In the first few days after starting risperidone, I felt a markedly better response than to the prior SSRI/SNRI/NDRIs. A mental turmoil, anger and confusion is suddenly gone, some of which I didn't even notice until they were absent. Lucidity is up, concentration has improved, and, while I don't feel 100%, I definitely feel improvement. I feel like I'm having mild and long episodes of sobriety. It's the strangest thing. Still depressed, but can't believe how much confusion has evaporated. My thoughts are less disordered jumps and leaps between topics and ideas, and forming coherent, self-supporting thoughts is growing on me. No apparent negative side effects so far, aside from the sedation.

    In short, this is the first time I've felt hopeful about a med. The good has damped down since starting, but since I'm only on 1mg, I suspect we'll increase dosage soon.

    There has been a little concern about EPS and TD when I paired bupropion with venlafaxine. I started having body twitches, some severe enough to hurt, in episodic fits throughout the day. Stopped the venlafaxine and now I just have a few (1-2) very soft twitches every second or third night.

    But last night I had a fit of 5 or 6 (whole body, though mild enough not to cause muscle pain), then my arm jerked, then my leg jerked. I'm worried.

    I really, really don't want to have to give up this new medication. The thought makes me want to curl up and lie on the floor. Thinking about stopping colors my thoughts with self-harm.

  14. Patience and following your doctor's prescription, and then more patience. Sucks, I know.

    When I was having uncomfortable mental reactions to one drug, I would do something that typically engrossed me, and I'd put everything else on hold. I would abandon myself to the thing and hope for tunnel-vision to weather the storm. For me it included reverie over an area of research interest or some rogue-like pc game. Being able to slip into some other kind of zone outside of myself was helpful.

  15. Hi Newbie :smile: ,

    I am curious to know how the Adderall and Wellbutrin are working for you? I've been taking Adderall 10mg for a couple years after being diagnosed with ADHD. I'm 39 yrs old. I have had depression and social anxiety on and off for much of my life. I've been on different antidepressants over the years. My Psychiatrist recently started me on Wellbutrin XL 150mg almost 3 weeks ago, and then about 1 week ago, she increased it to Wellbutrin XL 300mg per day since my low, uncaring, sad, unmotivated mood hasn't improved.

    I"m just wondering how the combination of the 2 meds has worked out for you. Also are you on Adderall immediate release or XR? I'm not feeling much from the Wellbutrin yet and it's been almost 3 weeks, and just trying to figure out how long until I might start feeling self-motivated to do things,and to overall have my mood improve.

    Sunshine, welcome to the forums.

    I tried 450mg bupropion XL plus 20mg adderall (latter prescribed for depression rather than ADHD). Buproprion response was much milder than to adderall, and took longer to manifest and stabilize (...give it 2 months, or your doctor's recommendation). Neither of the drugs made me feel particularily motivated, but I did wash the dishes a few times and the bupropion got me off the floor, along with therapy. They're both dopaminergic, so I'd hazard your response will be subtle after having taken adderall for a few years. Combination didn't do enough for me to stick with it, but maybe it will for you.

  16. Sorry you've had such a rough time.

    Just wanted to pop in and offer that I think it's normal human behavior to judge other's lives in a more positive light than you view your own, and that tendency is exacerbated by depression. Lots of people who we think "have it together" are themselves struggling.

    Anecdotally, I have been offered several times last year that a third party in the work place was, in different permutations, impressed by how "together" I was, confident, competent, stoic, and independent I appeared. Behind the scenes, I was juggling opiates and alcohol and brooding on suicide and self harm on a daily basis.

    It's easy to fall into a rut of wanting that "thing" someone else has, and it increases depression. For me, this has been the case, anyway. Compariing myself to others was a terribly negative habit that's kept me down. Therapy has helped that a bit.

  17. Any pointers?

    Well that stinks you feel he's a bad fit. For what it's worth, I have to pay out-of-pocket for my psychiatrist appointments, and that gave me more choice in the matter. The way I chose them was by asking peers who had therapy "what's your psych like?". When someone described what I wanted, I got the phone number. Consulting peers is probably too revealing a strategy for most people, though.

    When it came time to change psychs, I asked for my current psych's recommendation selected from her peers, and that was considered over a few appointments. Recommendation based on what I wanted, mostly, but what she thought would be best for me too.

  18. Yes, a mental health specialist will be better than a primary care physician for these matters, all else being equal.

    In my experience, not typical. 15 minutes to assess and prescribe a new medication seems woefully insufficient, but maybe i'm naive and he's a flipping genius. I've managed to choose physicians that took the time to exchange information not just to his or her satisfaction, but moreoever to my own satisfaction. They're ok with therapy on my own time, but they want sufficient time with me regularly themselves because (in part) they've felt a lot of responsibility in prescribing anything affecting brain chemistry.

    So many factors can play a role in depression and there's so much information that can be gathered before shunting off a patient to tough out two months of trying a new med which may or may not be appropriate.

    Do you have follow-ups scheduled with him to assess the status of the medication?

  19. If chemical imbalance is responsible for this, then could someone explain the process?


    No person has directly perceived or concluded the mechanism behind the varying manifestations of depression. Pharma would like you to believe it's a "chemical imbalance of this or that chemical", but no psychiatrist worth her salt will tell you the same. It could be wholly environmental, it could be entirely genetic, it's probably some combination of the two - in different degrees for every single person. Medication in the "chemical imbalance" game comes down to educated guesses.

    No such thing as "depression with no reason". Identifying the cause is the rub.

  20. Risperidone has had some positive effect the very first week. Too tired to summarize in justice right now, but has been the best medication I've tried so far for anhedonia, not to mention disordered thought process and confusion, agitation, angry (isn't the right word) energy, depression, etc. I wish I had tried an atypical sooner, but its been a pragmatic winnowing and it's good to know those other drugs are inappropriate for me.

    Has anyone tried aphetimine salts? I took some from a friend with ADD, but havent used it yet. I want to expirement, see if it does anything. Bad idea?

    Yes, see my posts these last few pages. Increased focus, sure. No real effect on anhedonia. Was prescribed by my psychiatrist for off-label use. Ran out a week or whatever ago and decided in concert with psych not to get refilled. Results were similar to when I first started bupropion, and afterwards it seemed just a sugar pill that may have temporarily (fingers crossed) accelerated hair loss. But I've got the bald genes, so sooner or later anyway, whichever.

    edit: and i'm sure you're aware, but just in case - you can deplete your dopamine levels (or so I am told) by inappropriate use of adderall - which would be a step in the wrong direction. It might help you, it might be benign, it might be pretty bad.

    even if it does help, there are some questions as to whether it would be efficacious in the long-term. I've read that it is usually only a short-term solution when for off-label use.

  21. I have only been on Wellbutrin SR 100mg for 5 days, and 50mg for 4 days before that. I am finding the increased anxiety unbearable. My question is whether I can stop it cold turkey, since I have been on it for such a short amount of time. My doc says I have not even reached the "therapeutic dose - 200 mg" yet. I am supposed to be titrating up to that today, but I am too terrified because of the non-stop panic symptoms. So, can I just stop it altogeher, without going back down to 50 mg for a week, etc.? Thanks in advance for any advice.

    You'll have to rely on the recommendation of your mental health specialist for your specific circumstances. That being said, I stopped 300mg after a few months cold turkey, no problems, no objections from my psychiatrist.

    My psych has pointed out that bupropion can contraindicated by excessive anxiety, so it's a reason others have backed down to.

    I thought "therapeautic dose" varied very much from person to person, and there is no "200mg" rule.

  22. I took the 20mg adderall plus 450mg bupropion a few weeks longer, and no noticeable effect upon anhedonia. i did occasionally become very talkative and loud conversation, and increased my blood pressure and resting heart rate.

    MAOI route still on the batting lineup, but temporarily y on hold and just started risperidone. Not been diagnosed with either bipolar or schizophrenia (and don't expect to be). Hope those symptoms shared by schizophrenia and anhedonia are affected positively, but am taking based more on a "spray and pray" psychiatric philosophy.

    Hello, I'm 23, I'm french and I have been anhedonic for almost 2 years now. It's really an awful condition and sometimes I feel that I can't take it anymore and that I should be dead instead (and I feel guilty not to have the courage to end it all).

    The worst part is that for psychiatrists it doesn't even exist. There's no such thing as a loss of feeling and joy without depression, in the opinion of psychiastrists....<snip>

    WELCOME to the forums, Prima. I've not the attention span to digest all of your post (sorry, my attention span is poor), but wanted to interject:

    I'm sorry the psychiatrists you've interacted with have been so unsupportive; those I've met with (only a few - so small sample size) accepted anhedonia as an identifier of depression, not something that must follow in the wake of depression. Don't accept a close-minded psychiatrist, if you can help it.

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