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Lithium Orotate.


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18 replies to this topic

#1 BocaGirl

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 08:19 PM

Has anyone on here tried lithium orotate. I am curious to try a natural alternative to prescription mood stabilizers. But, I also dont' want to take anything that could hurt me. It is very inexpensive. If anyone out there has tried it I would love to here your experience with it.

Edited by lindahurt, 08 September 2011 - 10:55 PM.


#2 Xande

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 09:21 PM

Never tried it. I take chelated magnesium and it works well for sleep.

I would do a quick search online for reviews if possible before trying it out.

Good luck!

Edited by lindahurt, 08 September 2011 - 11:45 PM.


#3 HelenLlama

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 10:28 PM

If you are considering Lithium Orotate, then at least consider the prescription forms. (Lithium Carbonate/Lithium Citrate)

Also at the end of the day lithium is lithium no matter the form of the salt it is, which is the difference between what you are considering and prescription Lithium.

From what I have heard is in the US Lithium Carbonate is on some $4 lists so is also cheap.

Edited by lindahurt, 09 September 2011 - 01:02 AM.


#4 lukn4hope

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Posted 08 September 2011 - 11:58 PM

What HelenLlama said is true. Lithium is lithium and all of it is natural. But if you take the prescription lithium, you will be under the care of a doctor who can monitor your blood levels and make sure that you get a therapeutic dose and not a toxic dose. All lithium in excess can be toxic. And too little lithium does nothing and is a waste of money.
Disclaimer: I am not a doctor, nor do I play one on TV. The information provided by me is intended purely for entertainment purposes.

#5 swimfan93

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Posted 09 September 2011 - 04:27 PM

Lithium needs to be at a certain level for it to work, and this level needs to monitored by a doctor. I take lithium and keeping the blood level stable is very important.

#6 ufecart

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Posted 06 January 2013 - 05:47 PM

Also at the end of the day lithium is lithium no matter the form of the salt it is, which is the difference between what you are considering and prescription Lithium.

This is a common but dangerous assumption. Lithium orotate actually builds up in the heart and kidneys and is not excreted via urine as readily as lithium carbonate. In both places it stands to do some severe damage. Do a thorough search of pubmed and read all that apply.



#7 spiritsage

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Posted 08 June 2013 - 02:42 PM

Lithium IS NOT lithium. Do your own research, but the carbonate form is much more TOXIC, which is why it requires scrip; it is also much less efficient crossing the blood brain barrier. For some reason orotate crosses the bb more easily, and routes more effectively to the parts of the brain where it needs to be, requiring much lower dose. The only reason I haven't converted yet is the dosage issue. Supposedly 1/8 as much; I'm working with a naturopath to figure out a dose an schedule for conversion- will report back when done.
Research and be your own advocate- if you discuss with your shrink they will prob say it's not safe- that is based on a single study done many years ago showing kidney damage in rats. ONE STUDY. But your md's pharm rep is on that like white on rice to their own interests. Google it, follow all the links. To your health safely....

#8 KaChow

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 05:55 PM

^^^ Excellent point by spiritsage... Certainly do not mix up your Lithiums and certainly see a Doctor if you are considering the medication. I happen to agree the cost is effecient with Lithium as it dinosaur medication, but it is highly effective at least in my instance. Lithium can be dangerous if it is not monitored, and that is done through regular blood tests. I hate giving blood, often faint after doing so, but the affects this medication has are worth it. I can't say that I have tried the Orotate or Carbonate version, however I do use the XR or extended release, which appears in 450mgs, I happen to take 900mgs and feel calm, collective, also this level matches my most blood level (which at the time of the test there was 200mgs of Lithium in blood stream), so I am able to handle more and for some time I did at 1350mgs, I believe the highest known dose is 1800mgs but at that level, I couldn't imagine the individual that would have a blood count that withstand that dosage amount.   



#9 spiritsage

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Posted 10 June 2013 - 11:01 PM

Your XR is a carbonate form. The orotate is a much more efficient form and requires only ~1/8 the dose of carbonate forms...fyi...do some research....

#10 electrochemistry

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 12:54 AM

I recently tried lithium orotate 5mg per day for 2 weeks. Felt fantastic for about 3 days. But, it progressively made me more aggressive, in an undesirable way. I found out that orotate was once considered a form of vitamin B. All B type vitamin supplements i've tried thus far have caused the same issue for me, that is, progressively making me more aggressive. Orotate appeared to have the same effect on me as the various B vitamins. So my take so far on lithium orotate is that orotate is the wrong transporter for lithium in bipolar disorder sufferers.

 

Also tried lithium aspartate which seemed to take a bit longer to activate my aggression, but eventually did. More research by me and i find that aspartate is an excitotoxin. Excitotoxins (in most processed foods) give me a short term mood lift and a longer term mood slump, and energy so low that I struggle to read and listen to people. Orotate and aspartate are dud transporters for the lithium in my case. I had such high hiopes for them too. Now I'm trying to boost lithium through lithium rich foods instead. So far the lithium rich foods are keeping my moods more stable than the supplements. I will try prescription lithium carbonate if the foods show signs of not being quite effective enough for me.



#11 KaChow

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 02:42 PM

Your XR is a carbonate form. The orotate is a much more efficient form and requires only ~1/8 the dose of carbonate forms...fyi...do some research....

 

Thank you for the clarification, as I tend to just read labels and I do understand the medication I take, rather I wouldn't take it if I didn't. Good suggestion in researching the orotate form, but for the most part I imagine as the case in almost every circumstance, I will find information that is fact base supporting. You mention the orotate is a much more efficient form, is that because of the lower dose, what supports the idea that the orotate is better than the carbonate. And of course anything that is fact base is always helpful.



#12 spiritsage

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 04:32 PM

Most of the research I have done on Orotate was done while visiting my Naturopathic MD/friend who lives in Texas, on her computer. When I search from Hawaii I get different results, I suppose because I connect thru different servers. There were two main sites, one was bipolarworld.net, the other I cannot remember or find- yet. Will try to get it from my friend and post here for fyi.

 

Because it is more efficient you need a lower dose. I still don't have enough info to make the switch myself, but I am working the issue as hard as I can- I believe it is the next step towards improvement. Fairly recently I found out my thyroid is compromised and I started taking meds for this- that is a recognized effect of the carbonate form. I've also had problems with various hormones getting way out of norm (5x normal maximum), and although neither my MD or endocrinologist will fess up, I believe it may be a result of the toxicity inherent to the carbonate form.

 

I will post as I find out more....



#13 spiritsage

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Posted 11 June 2013 - 07:12 PM

Here is the other website I referred to in my previous message: www.verizon.net/res003jh/lithium-orotate/

 

There is a q&a that addresses some dosing issues. Fyi, I am still waiting for recommendations on a schedule to follow and will post asap.

 

cheers!



#14 KaChow

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Posted 12 June 2013 - 01:36 PM

Here is the other website I referred to in my previous message: www.verizon.net/res003jh/lithium-orotate/

 

There is a q&a that addresses some dosing issues. Fyi, I am still waiting for recommendations on a schedule to follow and will post asap.

 

cheers!

Thank you spiritsage for this post and one above it. I nearly brought up the topic of Orotate vs. Carbonate with my Doctor earlier this morning. I will do some research as well.



#15 electrochemistry

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Posted 15 June 2013 - 05:09 AM

found it on this link -

http://mysite.verizo...tate/index.html

 

just a warning - orotate is overly stimulating in my case, causing pronounced irritability. good luck to those that don't suffer this side effect.



#16 spiritsage

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Posted 19 June 2013 - 11:28 AM

Posting some progress in my conversion process. For seven days I took 1 300mg L Carbonate in the morning and 2 125mg L Orotate(each = 5mg base lithium) in the evenings. Didn't sense any differences in mood, sleep, etc. My actual conversion came out to 4.8 tabs of Orotate were equivalent to the 600mg of Carbonate I was taking, so yesterday I started taking 3 Orotate tabs in the morning.

 

Did have a discussion with my MD, just as I was starting this....he didn't know much about it(surprise?), promised to research, and agreed to schedule a lithium level blood test after about 6 weeks.

 

Will keep this board updated, but so far pretty uneventful.....



#17 spiritsage

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Posted 13 July 2013 - 10:14 PM

Since my last post I have been on the Orotate exclusively. I take 3am and 2pm; each is equivalent to 5mg lithium so I'm getting 25 mg/day. No real issues, I have had some downer days, but have discovered this can be influenced by other factors- sleep, diet, and other meds. Will see my primary MD 7/15 and we will schedule labs which will include lithium level....it will be very interesting to see if this dose is in fact maintaining a therapeutic level, or I've just "been lucky" my life hasn't blown up...

One thing that has been helpful...in addition to the lithium changes I have made a lot of other changes with diet, use of pain meds and reduced alcohol consumption. I've been keeping a diary of all the variables since mid June...I think this will be even more valuable over time, but already seeing some interesting interactions and correlations...will continue to update this string...aloha...



#18 electrochemistry

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Posted 20 November 2013 - 05:40 PM

Any updates on the lithium orotate?



#19 smokeygirl

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Posted 02 January 2014 - 08:09 PM

The orotate hasnt done a damn thing for me. My depression is still over over over the top.. nothing has worked yet.






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