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Omaha Mall Shooting *may Trigger*


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#1 Looking Up

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:45 PM

From the Minneapolis Star Tribune….

OMAHA, NEB. - A gunman in camouflage and wielding a rifle opened fire in an Omaha mall crowded with holiday shoppers Wednesday, ******* eight people and wounding five before turning the gun on himself.
The gunman, identified by the authorities as Robert A. Hawkins, 19, was described by friends and relatives as a depressed person who had struggled to hold a job.
Shoppers and store clerks described a surreal scene of panic and chaos after they heard shots ring out even as a pianist at the Westroads Mall played on.
Many witnesses, still in disbelief about what they had heard, dived into closets and storage rooms, crouched in dressing rooms, crowded behind desks and then began what became a long and terrifying wait, punctuated by more and more shots.
"All I could think was where is he, what if he comes through that door, what if he comes through right now," recalled Kevin Kleine, 29, a shopper who hid in a storage room with her 4-year-old daughter, Emily, and four women she had never met.
The group pushed every table, rack and garbage can they could find against the door and huddled behind clothes, making hushed calls to 911, to their husbands and to their parents.
Then began the long wait, 30 minutes, Kleine said, staring at that door.
It was believed to be the deadliest shooting incident in Nebraska history.
As the state's most populous city, with 419,000 residents, Omaha, along the Missouri River, has elements of urban woes like drugs and gangs.
Still, Kleine, said: "I've never even heard gunshots here before. Honestly, I didn't know what they sounded like until today, and I thought I never would."
Visitors to the mall said they were eating lunch and browsing in stores when three or four shots sounded just after 1:30 p.m. on the third floor of the Von Maur department store.
Witnesses said they could not see where the shots came from and scanned up and down the three floors of the mall, unsure how to escape something they could not see.
Others said they dismissed the noises as balloons popping or construction noises.
But quickly, as four more shots popped, people scrambled for cover. Some screamed. Others ran, dropped to the floor or searched for doors and dressing rooms and employee lounges.
Some people told of horrific images. A man talking on his cell phone and then falling to the floor. Someone shot in the back of the head, covered in blood. Someone shot on the second floor as he looked up an escalator.
Witnesses said they heard at least 15 shots in all, maybe more. Scores of police officers began swarming to the mall six minutes after the first call, police officials said. They locked down the mall, surrounding it.
Police helicopters circled overhead as officers searched for the suspect. Clusters of shoppers and workers, meanwhile, hid, unsure what would come next.
Police went store to store, department to department, finding clusters of people and ushering them out -- hands over their heads to show that they were not the gunman -- to safety outside. There, some wept and clutched one another in the frozen air. Eventually, the police found the gunman's body.
A short time after the shooting, a woman whom authorities described as related to the case delivered a note to the Sarpy County Sheriff's Department. Capt. Rolly Yost of the department said the note could be viewed as suicidal.
Debora Maruca, whose teenage sons had befriended Hawkins, said she and her husband let Hawkins stay with them after he was kicked out of his family's house. She would not say why his family had kicked him out.
"He was depressed, and he had always been depressed," Maruca said. "But he looked like he was getting better."
Hawkins, who earned a GED after dropping out of Papillion-La Vista High School, got a driver's license after moving in with the Marucas and five months ago started working at a McDonald's restaurant near their home in suburban Bellevue, Maruca said.
Hawkins was not on any medication for mental illness, but he had been treated in the past for depression and attention deficit disorder/hyperactivity disorder, Maruca said.
Though he had his troubles, Hawkins was gentle, Maruca said. But he also had a drinking problem and would occasionally (self medicate) in his bedroom, she said. Hawkins liked to listen to music and play video games -- "normal teenager stuff," she said.


Does this add hype to the stigma of depression?

Edited by Looking Up, 06 December 2007 - 02:47 PM.


#2 Obsessing

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:48 PM

Absolutely, I think that is why so many people who are depreseed have a difficult time admitting it because they are afraid of the stigma that it will throw on them.
"suppression is the

deepest

form of therapy"



#3 Looking Up

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:50 PM

I hate when the media breaks with a story like this and then fuels the fire with "history of mental illness"

I'm sorry but this person does not reflect all of mental health society, the fact that he was depressed and NOT RECIEVING TREATMENT should have been a big red flag to those who cared for him... Why the :hearts: wasn't someone trying to help the poor guy? They all KNEW he was depressed for goodness sake!

#4 Obsessing

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 02:56 PM

I hate when the media breaks with a story like this and then fuels the fire with "history of mental illness"

I'm sorry but this person does not reflect all of mental health society, the fact that he was depressed and NOT RECIEVING TREATMENT should have been a big red flag to those who cared for him... Why the :hearts: wasn't someone trying to help the poor guy? They all KNEW he was depressed for goodness sake!


And the Answer is..........An Increasingly Individualized Society........People just don't care about each other anymore :bump:
"suppression is the

deepest

form of therapy"



#5 slw

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:02 PM

people don't do anything because most of them don't know what should be done -- and often they're afraid of hurting the person's feelings

i know that i have problems with my own son because i don't want to make him feel like i think he has worse problems than he really does -- i don't want to hurt his self-esteem & confidence any more than it already has been

this kind of reporting does add to the stigma -- what the media needs to do is balance it with reports of people who have gotten help & are doing better
they need to put some public service ads on -- like all the anti-smoking ones -- about how if you feel this way or that way, here's what you should do
they should talk about how many people actually have a mental illness and how it's not the end of the world

basically, people need to be educated so that the fear & stigma can be minimized.

#6 Looking Up

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:03 PM

It just really upsets me how the media makes a big deal out of his mental illness... For the future of those of us that suffer from MI issues, we will be further scrutinized in the eyes of society... everyone will be waiting for one of us to snap...

This makes me ill....

And the Answer is..........An Increasingly Individualized Society........People just don't care about each other anymore :hearts:


I beg to differ... I know that my friends here at DF care, and my family and friends care, I'm sorry, but being one of the people in this world that actually does care about others in the human race, I refuse to believe that people don't care. I can't believe that, otherwise what do we have anymore?

#7 Obsessing

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:05 PM

people don't do anything because most of them don't know what should be done -- and often they're afraid of hurting the person's feelings

i know that i have problems with my own son because i don't want to make him feel like i think he has worse problems than he really does -- i don't want to hurt his self-esteem & confidence any more than it already has been

this kind of reporting does add to the stigma -- what the media needs to do is balance it with reports of people who have gotten help & are doing better
they need to put some public service ads on -- like all the anti-smoking ones -- about how if you feel this way or that way, here's what you should do
they should talk about how many people actually have a mental illness and how it's not the end of the world

basically, people need to be educated so that the fear & stigma can be minimized.


Absoulty agree slw but that won't make the news like "PEOPLE SHOT"
"suppression is the

deepest

form of therapy"



#8 Looking Up

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:06 PM

people don't do anything because most of them don't know what should be done -- and often they're afraid of hurting the person's feelings

i know that i have problems with my own son because i don't want to make him feel like i think he has worse problems than he really does -- i don't want to hurt his self-esteem & confidence any more than it already has been

this kind of reporting does add to the stigma -- what the media needs to do is balance it with reports of people who have gotten help & are doing better
they need to put some public service ads on -- like all the anti-smoking ones -- about how if you feel this way or that way, here's what you should do
they should talk about how many people actually have a mental illness and how it's not the end of the world

basically, people need to be educated so that the fear & stigma can be minimized.


I actually sent an email to my local news station, about how upset I am that they are emphasizing his mental illness... and not the fact that he didn't get help. They actually replied back and want to speak further to me... I think I might do it, but I'm nervous..lol As someone who suffers with depression and BDD and Anxiety, I really don't know about being on TV. But I feel SOMEONE has to defend those with mental illness who are in treatment, and make people realize that we aren't all going to end up like this.....

#9 ISeeBluePeople

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 03:50 PM

It just really upsets me how the media makes a big deal out of his mental illness... For the future of those of us that suffer from MI issues, we will be further scrutinized in the eyes of society... everyone will be waiting for one of us to snap...

This makes me ill....

And the Answer is..........An Increasingly Individualized Society........People just don't care about each other anymore :hearts:


I beg to differ... I know that my friends here at DF care, and my family and friends care, I'm sorry, but being one of the people in this world that actually does care about others in the human race, I refuse to believe that people don't care. I can't believe that, otherwise what do we have anymore?

I have to agree with Obsessing. Our society-our American culture has been on an increasingly downhill slide with no end in sight. I have no doubt people are becoming depersonalized. Its different here because our illness separates us from the unfeeling zombies. And if you are lucky enough to have love and support from your family and friends, you are Blessed. Many of us don't. :bump:
In all my bitterness, I ignored all thats real and true. All I need is You. Posted Image

Posted ImagePosted Image

#10 slw

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 05:53 PM

people don't do anything because most of them don't know what should be done -- and often they're afraid of hurting the person's feelings

i know that i have problems with my own son because i don't want to make him feel like i think he has worse problems than he really does -- i don't want to hurt his self-esteem & confidence any more than it already has been

this kind of reporting does add to the stigma -- what the media needs to do is balance it with reports of people who have gotten help & are doing better
they need to put some public service ads on -- like all the anti-smoking ones -- about how if you feel this way or that way, here's what you should do
they should talk about how many people actually have a mental illness and how it's not the end of the world

basically, people need to be educated so that the fear & stigma can be minimized.


Absoulty agree slw but that won't make the news like "PEOPLE SHOT"


I agree with you, but they need to do something.

you see, i'm especially sensitive to these reports -- way before my son began to have psychotic episodes, he had terrible social anxiety and rarely spoke in school. he would make comments about the other kids saying he would be the one to shoot up the school -- and he's not violent or angry at all -- just quiet.

and now that he has a psychosis that involves delusions/paranoia, i could really see how he could one day hurt someone by thinking he was protecting himself. when he's in one of these episodes, he thinks that people (usually from the govt) are coming to **** him. one day, he went with us somewhere while he was like that and i waited in the truck with him. he was in the back seat with tinted windows & we were parked under a building in the shade -- the building has offices on the 2nd & 3rd floor and parking on the 1st under the support columns. there was a really old man that pulled over to the side of the road across the street to use the cell phone -- he must have been at least 100 ft away -- but my son went on & on about how he was watching him. there's no way the guy could even see him.

so anyway -- those people shooting up places, that could have been my son if we didn't have him in treatment

so I know that we can't compete with the headlines, but something mainstream needs to be done

i wish i could do more than just talk about it, but my son is my first priority -- maybe one of these days when he's older & stable, i'll take up a second career as an activist or a lobbyist

#11 slw

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 05:55 PM

It just really upsets me how the media makes a big deal out of his mental illness... For the future of those of us that suffer from MI issues, we will be further scrutinized in the eyes of society... everyone will be waiting for one of us to snap...

This makes me ill....

And the Answer is..........An Increasingly Individualized Society........People just don't care about each other anymore :hearts:


I beg to differ... I know that my friends here at DF care, and my family and friends care, I'm sorry, but being one of the people in this world that actually does care about others in the human race, I refuse to believe that people don't care. I can't believe that, otherwise what do we have anymore?

I have to agree with Obsessing. Our society-our American culture has been on an increasingly downhill slide with no end in sight. I have no doubt people are becoming depersonalized. Its different here because our illness separates us from the unfeeling zombies. And if you are lucky enough to have love and support from your family and friends, you are Blessed. Many of us don't. :bump:


off-topic -- but everyone you know -- friends & family -- they just need a kick in the a--

#12 Magicseaweed

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 06:03 PM

I agree with ISeeBluePeople and Obessing, America is probably one of the most selfish countries in terms of individualism in society. I've been living in the USA for 2.5 years, and with my own two eyes thats the frist thing I noticed when I moved here.

I know there are people that care, but the majority doesn't, and probably will continue not to.

It just really upsets me how the media makes a big deal out of his mental illness... For the future of those of us that suffer from MI issues, we will be further scrutinized in the eyes of society... everyone will be waiting for one of us to snap...

This makes me ill....

And the Answer is..........An Increasingly Individualized Society........People just don't care about each other anymore :hearts:


I beg to differ... I know that my friends here at DF care, and my family and friends care, I'm sorry, but being one of the people in this world that actually does care about others in the human race, I refuse to believe that people don't care. I can't believe that, otherwise what do we have anymore?

I have to agree with Obsessing. Our society-our American culture has been on an increasingly downhill slide with no end in sight. I have no doubt people are becoming depersonalized. Its different here because our illness separates us from the unfeeling zombies. And if you are lucky enough to have love and support from your family and friends, you are Blessed. Many of us don't. :bump:



#13 slw

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 06:20 PM

I also agree to some extent -- but then I'll be amazed by some kindness I've witnessed by someone with nothing to gain by being kind.

I think that's part of what keeps me going -- I purposely try to look for little miracles & kind gestures -- and humor in everyday things.
Little things that are probably stupid or unimportant to most people seem to bring me great joy -- I explain it as being easily entertained.

But, you're all right -- most people are so wrapped up in their everyday lives of making the almighty dollar or whatever else drives them that they don't have time to pay attention to anyone else's problems.

I agree with ISeeBluePeople and Obessing, America is probably one of the most selfish countries in terms of individualism in society. I've been living in the USA for 2.5 years, and with my own two eyes thats the frist thing I noticed when I moved here.

I know there are people that care, but the majority doesn't, and probably will continue not to.

It just really upsets me how the media makes a big deal out of his mental illness... For the future of those of us that suffer from MI issues, we will be further scrutinized in the eyes of society... everyone will be waiting for one of us to snap...

This makes me ill....

And the Answer is..........An Increasingly Individualized Society........People just don't care about each other anymore :hearts:


I beg to differ... I know that my friends here at DF care, and my family and friends care, I'm sorry, but being one of the people in this world that actually does care about others in the human race, I refuse to believe that people don't care. I can't believe that, otherwise what do we have anymore?

I have to agree with Obsessing. Our society-our American culture has been on an increasingly downhill slide with no end in sight. I have no doubt people are becoming depersonalized. Its different here because our illness separates us from the unfeeling zombies. And if you are lucky enough to have love and support from your family and friends, you are Blessed. Many of us don't. :bump:



#14 Magicseaweed

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 06:29 PM

slw, I'm with you on that one, when someone says hello to me or holds the door at school, instead of letting it slam in your face when you're entering the classroom, any little thing is enough to make my day. Part of my depression is being indifferent to the culture, making me feel like I should never have been born on this side of the world because everyone seems cold or blind from money etc.

Edited by aecrimarco, 06 December 2007 - 06:29 PM.


#15 BookEater

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Posted 06 December 2007 - 09:56 PM

Does this add hype to the stigma of depression?

I guess I am alone in my opinion. I do not see how this adds to the stigma of depression. In fact, maybe Richard's story will increase recognition of the importance of treatment for depression. It is human reaction to want to know why something happens. His mental state is key to the story and his motive. In my opinion, it would be irresponsible of the media not to report on it. Once again, I hope his story leads to more proactive solutions and awareness in dealing with depression.

I am sad that he didn't receive treament and help. I am sad that he thought the only option was to commit suicide and in his turmoil decided to murder others as well. I am sad for him, his family, the victims, and their families. This is a horrible tragedy all around. Yet, this is a reality of depression. Yes, it is an extreme but still very much a reality. There is no reason to sugar-coat the facts...Depression kills people every day both by suicide and homicide.

BookEater
No change, no pause, no hope! Yet I endure....

#16 BookEater

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Posted 07 December 2007 - 03:00 AM

people don't do anything because most of them don't know what should be done -- and often they're afraid of hurting the person's feelings

i know that i have problems with my own son because i don't want to make him feel like i think he has worse problems than he really does -- i don't want to hurt his self-esteem & confidence any more than it already has been

this kind of reporting does add to the stigma -- what the media needs to do is balance it with reports of people who have gotten help & are doing better
they need to put some public service ads on -- like all the anti-smoking ones -- about how if you feel this way or that way, here's what you should do
they should talk about how many people actually have a mental illness and how it's not the end of the world

basically, people need to be educated so that the fear & stigma can be minimized.


I actually sent an email to my local news station, about how upset I am that they are emphasizing his mental illness... and not the fact that he didn't get help. They actually replied back and want to speak further to me... I think I might do it, but I'm nervous..lol As someone who suffers with depression and BDD and Anxiety, I really don't know about being on TV. But I feel SOMEONE has to defend those with mental illness who are in treatment, and make people realize that we aren't all going to end up like this.....


:hearts: That's great Looking Up!!

Edited by BookEater, 07 December 2007 - 03:01 AM.

No change, no pause, no hope! Yet I endure....

#17 slw

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Posted 07 December 2007 - 08:23 AM

Does this add hype to the stigma of depression?

I guess I am alone in my opinion. I do not see how this adds to the stigma of depression. In fact, maybe Richard's story will increase recognition of the importance of treatment for depression. It is human reaction to want to know why something happens. His mental state is key to the story and his motive. In my opinion, it would be irresponsible of the media not to report on it. Once again, I hope his story leads to more proactive solutions and awareness in dealing with depression.

I am sad that he didn't receive treament and help. I am sad that he thought the only option was to commit suicide and in his turmoil decided to murder others as well. I am sad for him, his family, the victims, and their families. This is a horrible tragedy all around. Yet, this is a reality of depression. Yes, it is an extreme but still very much a reality. There is no reason to sugar-coat the facts...Depression kills people every day both by suicide and homicide.

BookEater

I would agree -- but with all of the shootings that have happened, you get all this coverage of the victims and the survivors -- and you get maybe 1/10 of that coverage for the mental illness behind it. They spend way more time on all of the gun control issues.

And no matter what your stand on gun control, this isn't really a gun control issue if you get to the core of the problem. The problem is that you have someone with deepseated issues that is not getting the treatment and support that they need -- you have someone that has been almost shunned by mainstream society and they finally explode.

Last night, I was watching a news channel -- CN8 I think, it's not what I normally watch -- and they were taking callers. They were asking about the shooting in the context of gun control and whether or not the shooter (sorry I hate calling him the shooter, but I can't remember his name) had been let down by the system. A lady called in that had worked in one of the juvenile facilities that he had been in. She said he was in there for drugs but she thought he had more issues that weren't being addressed, that he was quiet & well-behaved there and never gave them any trouble, but that he was even considered kind of an outcast by his peers there.

And -- as I have an 18 year old that has some similiar issues -- I wonder what happened that made his parents throw him out of the house? I feel so sorry for him -- just like I've felt so sorry for everyone else that's done what he has. I'm also sorry that people had to die or be traumatized, but I think about how tortured these people were -- and how alone they must have felt for a long time.

#18 Backza

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Posted 19 December 2007 - 07:52 AM

What an awful awful event.

My thoughts go out to all who have been touched in anyway of this tragic event.

#19 zamardii

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Posted 29 March 2008 - 08:34 PM

I've only been depressed for about 2 months, and it seemingly came out of nowhere. And for me, every time I hear or read a story like this I get the chills, and anxious. Like, the feeling "if he was depressed, then I could end up doing that." Even though I consciously know I could never hurt anyone or anything. But then my mind switches to, "well you're only 21, who knows what will happen in the year down the road." It's really annoying and I try to push it out of my mind very quickly.

However, it's still a "spike" for me. I "spike" every time I read stuff like that, and I really wish it didn't.




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